SENATE COMMITTEE ON NATURAL RESOURCES

MINUTES OF THE

SENATE Committee on Natural Resources

Seventy-First Session

February 14, 2001

The Senate Committee on Natural Resourceswas called to order by Chairman Dean A. Rhoads, at 1:30 p.m., on Wednesday, February 14, 2001, in Room 2144 of the Legislative Building, Carson City, Nevada. Exhibit A is the Agenda. Exhibit B is the Attendance Roster. All exhibits are available and on file at the Research Library of the Legislative Counsel Bureau.

COMMITTEE MEMBERS PRESENT:

Senator Dean A. Rhoads, Chairman

Senator Lawrence E. Jacobsen, Vice Chairman

Senator Mike McGinness

Senator Mark A. James

Senator Raymond C. Shaffer

Senator Bob Coffin

Senator Maggie Carlton

STAFF MEMBERS PRESENT:

Fred Welden, Committee Policy Analyst

Johnnie L. Willis, Committee Secretary

OTHERS PRESENT:

Helen A. Foley, Lobbyist, Clark County Health District

Robert L. Vaught, Forest Supervisor, Forest Service, Intermountain Region, United States Department of Agriculture

Karen Shimamoto, Deputy Forest Supervisor, Forest Service, Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests, United States Department of Agriculture

Senator Rhoads reported to the committee that there was a request for a committee bill draft request (BDR) and that Helen Foley, Lobbyist, Clark County Health District, would explain the need for this BDR. (BDR 40-1296, later introduced as S.B. 533.)

Ms. Foley said the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Title V Program of the federal Clean Air Act mandates that there be certain provisions for health officials. One provision is the ability to seek criminal enforcement authority. Ms. Foley explained this provision is not included in Clark County’s adopted regulations. She mentioned the Clark County District Attorney recommended Clark County seek legislation allowing the enforcement of criminal fines. Ms. Foley said those criminal fines would only be for issues such as intentionally making false certifications or rendering inaccurate monitoring.

Ms. Foley said the legislation states, in the EPA Title V Program shown in the memorandum (Exhibit C), on page 6, item 5(e), that the permitting authority needs to have the authority to “enforce permits, permit fee requirements, and the requirement to obtain a permit, including authority to recover civil penalties in a maximum amount of not less that $10,000 per day for each violation, and provide appropriate criminal penalties.”

Ms. Foley said the Clark County Health District would like the Senate Committee on Natural Resources to request a BDR on this issue and to have a full hearing after the BDR is introduced.

Senator Rhoads questioned whether the state of Nevada would have to adjust its rules or whether the federal rules could be adopted. Ms. Foley replied the state of Nevada would need to adopt the federal regulations to allow for criminal penalties. She said the air quality division of Clark County Heath District does not presently have the authority to impose these penalties.

Ms. Foley explained one of the issues is whether to combine the criminal penalties program with the planning requirements provided by the Clark County comprehensive planning section. She said Clark County Comprehensive Planning does the state implementation plan and the health district enforces the plan.

Ms. Foley said the wording of the requested BDR included “control officer,” so that no matter what agency ends up enforcing the criminal fines, the wording in the BDR will still cover it.

Senator Coffin inquired whether the wording “criminal fine” is appropriate or whether it should be “criminal penalty.” Ms. Foley said the Clark County attorney had indicated “criminal fine” would be allowable, but so would the term “criminal penalty.” She said the Clark County Health District did not seek powers to arrest or to be required to obtain training from the Peace Officers’ Standards and Training Commission (P.O.S.T.). She told Senator Coffin she would check on the wording issue before the BDR was introduced.

SENATOR SHAFFER MOVED TO REQUEST A BILL DRAFT TO PROVIDE LEGISLATION TO ENFORCE CRIMINAL PENALTIES FOR VIOLATION TO THE CLEAN AIR ACT IN CLARK COUNTY HEALTH DISTRICT.

SENATOR COFFIN SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR JAMES WAS ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.)

*****

Senator Jacobsen indicated he had reservations about the issue. He cited a problem with a contractor who had three water trucks on a construction site when a whirlwind came up and blew debris everywhere. He said the contractor received a heavy fine because of an incident over which he had no control. Senator Jacobsen said there should be fines for an intentional violation, but there could be problems for a construction site, especially a road construction site.

Senator Rhoads stated this request should help with those kinds of problems. He explained that Ms. Foley’s proposed BDR should help take some of the “punches” out of the legislation.

Senator Rhoads said there are BDRs the committee needs to consider for introduction.

BILL DRAFT REQUEST R-723: Expresses opposition to designation of national monument by President of United States without obtaining approval of each state and local government in which national monument is located. (Later introduced as Senate Joint Resolution 2.)

SENATOR JACOBSEN MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR R-723.

SENATOR MCGINNESS SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR JAMES WAS ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.)

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST R-728: Directs Legislative Commission to conduct interim study relating to establishment, use and maintenance of certain roads in this state. (Later introduced as Senate Concurrent Resolution 8.)

SENATOR SHAFFER MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR R-728.

SENATOR JACOBSEN SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR JAMES WAS ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.)

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST R-310: Directs Legislative Commission to conduct interim study of quality and quantity of ground water within State of Nevada. (Later introduced as Senate Concurrent Resolution 5.)

SENATOR CARLTON MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR R-310.

SENATOR SHAFFER SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR JAMES WAS ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.)

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST R-727: Directs Legislative Commission to conduct interim study concerning wilderness areas and wilderness study areas in this state. (Later introduced as Senate Concurrent Resolution 6.)

SENATOR SHAFFER MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR R-727.

SENATOR MCGINNESS SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED. (SENATOR JAMES WAS ABSENT FOR THE VOTE.)

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST 40-308: Requires applicant for permit to operate certain water systems to provide documentation that applicant possesses sufficient water rights to operate system. (Later introduced as Senate Bill 161.)

SENATOR MCGINNESS MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR 40-308.

SENATOR JACOBSEN SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST 47-725: Creates position of seed bank coordinator within division of forestry of state department of conservation and natural resources. (Later introduced as Senate Bill 160.)

SENATOR JACOBSEN MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR 47-725.

SENATOR JAMES SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST 48-309: Makes various changes concerning protectible interests in domestic water wells. (Later introduced as Senate Bill 159.)

SENATOR SHAFFER MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR 48-309.

SENATOR CARLTON SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST S-721: Makes appropriation to legislative fund for use by Legislative Committee on Public Lands in awarding grants for certain projects relating to public lands. (Later introduced as Senate Bill 162.)

SENATOR JAMES MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR S-721.

SENATOR JACOBSEN SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.

*****

BILL DRAFT REQUEST S-724: Makes appropriation to Division of Forestry of State Department of Conservation and Natural Resources for creation of regional strike teams to assist in suppression of fires. (Later introduced as Senate Bill 158.)

SENATOR JAMES MOVED TO INTRODUCE BDR S-724.

SENATOR JACOBSEN SECONDED THE MOTION.

THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.

*****

Robert L. Vaught, Forest Supervisor, Forest Service, Intermountain Region, United States Department of Agriculture, in his presentation said the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests cover about 6.3 million acres, which is about 8 percent of Nevada’s land area. He pointed out there are 18 points of Nevada’s mountain ranges that are above 12,000 feet. Mr. Vaught noted that the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests are also about 8 percent of all of the national forest land in the United States.

Mr. Vaught said that the U.S. Forest Service has many programs, including one of the best research branches in the world, a state and private forestry organization, an extensive administration program, and an international forestry branch.

Mr. Vaught stated the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests are major recreational areas and receive almost 5 million visitors per year. Mr. Vaught explained the forest has 6000 miles of roads, 1700 miles of trails, 500 miles of off-road vehicle trails, and 1000 developed campsites. Also, he said, there are 4.7 million acres under grazing allotments and almost 300 of those grazing allotments include 420,000 head of livestock. There are over 500 approved plans for mining operations for the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests, and almost 1000 special use permits, he added.

Mr. Vaught stated that the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests are the largest forests outside of Alaska in the national forest system. He referred to page 2 of his handout, Statement of Robert L. Vaught (Exhibit D), and said his agency’s goal is “caring for the land and serving people.”

Mr. Vaught said the Public Lands Committee has been interested and involved in public land issues and is seeking ways to successfully resolve issues. He said his personal goal is to do everything he can to work with the people to resolve and overcome the differences and concerns. Mr. Vaught mentioned that some examples of the important work under way include the Governor’s sage grouse committee, the public lands summit, and work on fire issues. Mr. Vaught explained that one of the less obvious examples of ways people have helped the forestry service is the Jarbidge Shovel Brigade.

Mr. Vaught said the South Canyon Road (Jarbidge) issue is presently the most challenging task for the forestry service and for him personally. He said both sides of this issue have valid concerns. Mr. Vaught said his efforts are directed toward a settlement and finding a way the South Canyon Road can be rebuilt.

Mr. Vaught explained that in 1995 the South Canyon Road near Jarbidge was washed out. The road is in the bottom of a very small canyon and shares space with the stream that runs through that canyon. Mr. Vaught added that about every 10 years the water rises and washes out the road.

Mr. Vaught said that when the road washed out in 1995, the forestry service recommended it be rebuilt. Unfortunately, Trout Unlimited appealed the recommendation. He explained the regional forester reviewed the appeal and agreed with Trout Unlimited. Mr. Vaught said the regional forester said the forestry service needed to do a better job of analyzing the fisheries and the fact there are bull trout in that stream. The regional forester also said the forestry service had not adequately addressed that fact in its recommendation.

Mr. Vaught, continuing to explain the issue, said that in 1998 Elko County sent its road crew in to repair the road. In the process, the road crew rechanneled the stream and did so without consulting with the forestry service. Mr. Vaught noted that this act is a violation on federal lands. He noted authorization is required for any projects implemented on federal land. Mr. Vaught said the U.S. Forest Service repaired the work on the road and filed suit against Elko County for violation of the Clean Water Act and other issues.

Also, Mr. Vaught said, in 1998 the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service listed the bull trout as an endangered species in an emergency measure, and then later downgraded it to a threatened species. He said this heightened the level of concern for everyone involved.

Mr. Vaught noted along the same lines that on July 4, 1999, the Jarbidge Shovel Brigade (JSB) was formed, which is a third party not associated with Elko County. He explained the JSB attempted to rebuild about 300 feet of the beginning of the road by using hand shovels instead of heavy machinery.

Mr. Vaught said that last year the forestry service initiated a court-ordered settlement to solve the issues of the South Canyon Road. He said the settlement included economic incentive dollars for the community of Jarbidge, and called for a completion of the conservation plan to take care of the issue of the bull trout. Mr. Vaught explained that the settlement allowed the U.S. Forest Service to complete the National Environmental Policy Act of 1969 (NEPA) process so there can be a final decision about whether the road can be rebuilt and what the limitations to rebuilding the road would be. He said there was talk of moving the road out of the bottom of the canyon so it will not wash out in the future. Mr. Vaught said the settlement also settled all of the claims against Elko County for not obtaining permission to rebuild the road on federal lands.

Mr. Vaught commented Elko County, unfortunately, voted down the settlement. He said the settlement could have resolved many of the forestry service’s concerns and many of Elko County’s concerns.

Mr. Vaught said the federal district court judge in Reno has been trying to help the parties involved reach an agreement. The judge ordered everyone involved into a settlement conference with another judge, who works for the federal district court judge. Mr. Vaught said the parties met for 3 days and made a potential agreement. He said the forestry service and the other parties would be going back to court to try to close the agreement.

Senator Rhoads asked whether the judge would make a decision if the involved parties did not make an agreeable settlement. Mr. Vaught responded that the judge told them if an agreement could not be reached, he would move the issue into legal proceedings, and seek to move it quickly through the court system to obtain a decision as soon as possible. Mr. Vaught said the judge called it a “rocket docket,” and he thought that meant about 6 months, but he was not certain.

Senator Rhoads asked whether the daily fines are continuing. Mr. Vaught responded, “No, the fines are not continuing.”

Senator Jacobsen asked whether Mr. Vaught could provide the committee with photographs of the site for the committee to review. Mr. Vaught replied, “Yes, we could do that.”

Senator Jacobsen asked whether the U.S. Forest Service could still provide the photographs or a video even after the case is settled. Mr. Vaught answered that the U.S. Forest Service has a Microsoft PowerPoint® presentation that he could make available to the committee.

Senator Jacobsen, addressing the chairman, said he felt it would be advisable for the committee to review the presentation and to invite the Assembly committee to join the Senate Committee on Natural Resources. Senator Rhoads responded that the committee could consider the proposal.

Mr. Vaught said in the past year on the national forest lands there have been three mines that have been abandoned or have declared bankruptcy. He said the forestry service discovered it is unprepared for the level of reclamation that is necessary. Mr. Vaught explained that all three mines were “cyanide heap leach” operations. Mr. Vaught further explained the fluids used in these types of mining operations are very toxic and must be handled very carefully. Mr. Vaught noted that at one point a cow wandered into the area and drank from the pond and fell over dead right there.

Mr. Vaught said the flow of the fluids had to be maintained so the ponds would not overflow and cause environmental damage downstream from the ponds near the mining operations. He said the forestry service used all the bonding money to resolve the fluid issues, which left the rest of the mining operation unreclaimed.

Mr. Vaught said the agency needs approximately $3 million more to complete the reclamation of the abandoned mines. He said the forestry service has been working with U.S. Congressman Jim Gibbons, U.S. Senator Harry Reid, U.S. Senator John Ensign, the Nevada Division of Minerals, and the Nevada Mining Association to try to provide some support for the reclamation operations to resolve the problem. Mr. Vaught said U.S. Congressman Gibbons supported legislation to provide $5 million toward abandoned mine work. Unfortunately, most of the funds are assigned toward planning instead of reclamation, he added.

Mr. Vaught stated it is important to the forestry service that it does a good job of resource management and it is necessary that the forestry service support the mining community as a whole, not just the reclamation issue. Mr. Vaught said the challenging part for the forestry service in regard to the grazing program is that it is under constant and continuously increasing pressure to fulfill the forestry service’s responsibility of ensuring the grazing program is doing well. He said the program must be supported for it to continue. Mr. Vaught noted that he could not give specific data on issues that are still in the court system.

Mr. Vaught stated that in the eastern part of the state, in the former Humboldt National Forest, the forestry service is under a court-ordered mediation settlement requirement to do certain things and to fulfill certain responsibilities, which included the Lahontan cutthroat trout issue. He said the Lahontan cutthroat trout program is a part of many of the forestry service funding allotments. Mr. Vaught explained that the funding for this project is presently very tight, which results in the forestry service being unable to fulfill some of its basic requirements. He said the forestry service would need to work with the permittees to overcome many of the issues that are unresolved.

Mr. Vaught said that 10 years ago the forestry service had over 30 range contracts in Nevada, but today it has only 11, a decrease of about two-thirds. At this time, he commented, the forestry service is unable to fulfill its basic requirements for those 11 range contracts.

Senator Rhoads asked whether the forestry service for the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests received some of the grazing fees. Mr. Vaught answered, “No, Senator, those go into the general treasury.” He said 25 percent of those fees do eventually come back to the state and the counties through the “Payment to the States Act.”

Senator Rhoads asked whether the 420,000 head of livestock grazing on the park lands had declined in the last 10 years. Mr. Vaught responded that he did not have those figures with him. He did say he thinks the reduction was significant, however. Mr. Vaught said the Public Lands Committee was working with the Nevada Association of Counties (NACO) to come up with answers as to the changes over the last 10 years.

Mr. Vaught said around the Spring Mountain recreational area there are about 1.4 million residents that live within 30 minutes of the national forest. There are almost 10,000 vehicles a day visiting the area for things like snow play and for the scenery.

Mr. Vaught explained the Spring Mountain recreational area is another one of those under-funded areas and some of the area’s facilities are badly deteriorated, outdated, and “under capacity.” He said the Southern Nevada Public Land Management Act would help alleviate some of the problems.

Mr. Vaught said one of the things the forestry service is considering to help with the funding problem is to charge usage fees. He noted the forestry service is hoping to accomplish it in a cooperative way with the citizens of Nevada in the hope of preventing adverse reactions if a fee demonstration program is introduced.

Continuing, Mr. Vaught indicated part of the system the forestry service is considering is a cooperative system with the Bureau of Land Management (BLM) and the park services, which already have established usage fees. He commented that this option could lessen the burden of all the different usage fees by utilizing a pass system usable for more than one recreational area.

Senator Coffin asked whether Mr. Vaught was going to charge for access to Mount Charleston. Mr. Vaught said “Yes, that is what it means.” Mr. Vaught pointed out there was a lot of planning to do before the forestry service could implement any fees. Senator Coffin asked how much of the fees would return to the area. Mr. Vaught replied most of the funds would return directly to the area. Senator Coffin commented that generally the money goes back to the area, but only to build buildings to encourage people to visit the area they are already visiting free.

Karen Shimamoto, Deputy Forest Supervisor, Forest Service, Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests, United States Department of Agriculture, said the Red Rock Canyon recreational area for the BLM, and other recreational areas of the country are currently part of a recreation fee demonstration (fee demo) project. She said the driving loop in the Red Rock fee demo area actually gains an additional $1 million for the management of that area. The funds are for the maintenance of the road, the restrooms, visitor facilities, and the recreational trails. Ms. Shimamoto said the fees actually become an addition to the appropriated funds to help handle the increasing visitations to these areas.

Ms. Shimamoto said the forestry service is thinking about using an interagency pass system that could be used in the Red Rock area, the Spring Mountain area, and the desert wildlife area. She emphasized this is just an idea, at this point, and there is no set plan yet. Ms. Shimamoto said that in other parts of the county this plan has been acceptable to the public.

Senator Coffin asked what happens when the government has a disruption in service, and how the public would gain access to these areas. He also asked how property owners would gain access to their properties if there are gates that bar the way and no employees to operate them. Mr. Vaught replied that possible event would have to be worked out with the property owners. He said he did not envision having a gate that would lock out citizens. Mr. Vaught said the envisioned plan is to provide an opportunity, through a minimal fee approach, to maintain the campgrounds and the roads in ways that are not possible now. He said this is not a preference for the forestry service, but the forestry service would like to have the funds to do the work that needs to be done in those areas. Mr. Vaught said the forestry service must find ways to help itself in order to accomplish its goals for the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests. He said the forestry service would try to accomplish its goals in a way that will not lock out citizens or be a gate system.

Senator Coffin pointed out that there had been a lockout in 1995 at the Lake Mead recreational area (Lake Mead National Recreation Area is run by the National Park Service of the Department of the Interior) due to lack of payroll for the federal service employees, and what has happened once will happen again. The Senator wanted to know what the forestry service would do if there were another disruption of this kind. He said the public has always had access to these areas without fee and asked whether there could be another incidence of people being arrested for trying to access their properties. Mr. Vaught responded the forestry service is aware of the issue that occurred around Lake Mead, and that he would be happy to keep the Senator informed of what kind of plan develops and how the forestry service is planning to handle these kinds of problems.

Senator Coffin said there is apparently no penalty for breaking the rule of entering when the gate is closed. Mr. Vaught replied there would probably have to be a penalty eventually if people try to get in without paying the fee. He said the intent is that it be a cooperative effort with the citizens of Nevada.

Senator James stated that he has a problem with the concept of fees for recreational areas. He said the fee concept is a surprise, and he feels it would be very hard for Nevadans to accept the concept. The Senator said Nevadans would probably go to Spring Ranch and pay a fee for the state park without a problem. Senator James said he has a problem with the concept of a “bloated federal government with hundreds of millions and billions of dollars in surpluses,” not providing the forestry service in Nevada the million dollars it needs to fix the recreational areas. There is an incongruity here that boggles the mind, he added.

Senator James further stated that “We Nevadans are tax-dollar exporters to Washington,” and in return we get less than $10 per mile for federal highways in the state of Nevada. He pointed out that some of the eastern states get thousands of dollars per mile for federal highways. He stated “We Nevadans find ourselves in the position of having the federal government come to us and say, ‘by the way we are going to have to start charging fees for you to get into the recreational areas that are within your borders.’”

Continuing, Senator James said these areas are some of the few federal instillations that Nevadans can enjoy. He said now the forestry service wants to charge fees because it does not have enough money to maintain the areas properly as a result of the population growth that is causing strain on the recreational areas. Senator James admitted the situation is not Mr. Vaught’s fault, but said he wants to express his dissatisfaction with the “shortchange” Nevadans are receiving in this situation.

Senator James pointed out that even though the forestry service wants to present the charging of fees to the Nevada public in the best way possible, he does not believe there is a way to do that. He said it is not because Nevadans are “cheap or do not want to pay fees,” since Nevadans will probably pay the fees, but it is because of the unfairness of charging fees. He stated Nevadans do not receive back from the federal government a fair amount of money compared to other states.

Senator James said that before the forestry service starts charging fees and putting up gates, it should be determined how the Nevada Legislature could help the forestry service get the $1 million necessary to make the improvements. Mr. Vaught replied that he did not believe there would be gates.

Senator Rhoads said one thing the committee could do is to write the congressional delegation and other pertinent individuals about the area’s needs. He said the committee could, in the process, see whether there could be an appropriation made to the forestry service so it could take care of the needed repairs and improvements.

Mr. Vaught said he agrees with the committee’s frustration. He said there are facilities that have deteriorated over the last 30 years. Mr. Vaught explained that the park has 10,000 cars a day, which equals about 30,000 to 40,000 people a day using those deteriorating facilities. He said the forestry service did not know what else to do but initiate the fee system to obtain the funds to make repairs. He said the usage fee is one of the tools approved for the forestry service’s use to fund these kinds of projects, and he would appreciate any help the committee could offer.

Mr. Vaught emphasized he would like to continue to communicate with the committee on this problem, and also that the forestry service is in the very early planning stages of this project. He said there is a lot of work to do before implementation.

Senator James said the other kind of incongruity is that there are facilities that are deteriorating from lack of funds to repair them. However, when a road washes out in Jarbidge, the state of Nevada has to go back through the NEPA process to put it back where it already was. He said there are now lawyers and federal court judges involved, which is very expensive. Senator James said those funds could have been used for the repairs on the park lands.

Senator James said it seems when a relatively small problem occurs, such as Mother Nature washing out a road, the government is willing to expend a great amount of money for litigation, but the more important problem of making repairs to the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests’ facilities requires the forestry service to charge a usage fee.

Mr. Vaught said there is a national fire plan that is currently being implemented. He said this plan is the result of the intensive fire years that the West has had for the last 2 years. He said the forestry service has considerable funds that can only be used to implement the national fire plan. Mr. Vaught noted the forestry service is hiring additional fire employees, and working on restoring and rehabilitating burned areas, especially in the Reno area. He said the forestry service is working to reduce the risk of fire throughout the state.

Mr. Vaught said there are considerable dollars for community assistance that goes with the fire plan and that the forestry service has not had these kinds of funds in the past. Mr. Vaught said because of these additional funds, nearly all of the communities that border the national forest would get additional funding for their local fire department and for added training of personnel.

Mr. Vaught cited federal legislation that was passed in October of last year called “Secure Payments for Counties.” He said this new legislation increases the funds that will be returned to the counties in the state of Nevada. Mr. Vaught said the additional funds allow for the formation of resource advisory committees to work with the forestry service in planning activities on the forestry lands.

Mr. Vaught said the forestry service is working with the BLM, which has had the advisory committee system for many years, to help implement this system. He said for the forestry service this is a new system, and the forestry service has been in contact with counties around the state of Nevada on this issue. Mr. Vaught noted that the forestry service has made a presentation to the Nevada Association of Counties. He said that everyone involved believes it is possible to work through the new legislation for the benefit of counties in the state of Nevada.

Mr. Vaught stated that because Nevada does not have a large timber program, the millions of dollars for schools and road repair has gone to other states in the West, but does not come to Nevada. He said he would like to continue to seek ways in which the national forest is a benefit to the counties on its borders.

Mr. Vaught said he was open to any ideas from the Legislature or citizens of Nevada that would improve the interaction of the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests system and the citizens and governments of the counties on its borders. He said the counties in Nevada deserve support from the federal government for the lands that are national forests.

Mr. Vaught said that since 1993 over $700,000 had been given to counties and local governments through the state and private forestry program. He said the counties apply for grants and those grants are allocated as a part of the state and private forestry program. This program targets communities’ economic development and private landowners. Mr. Vaught noted the program has been very positive.

Mr. Vaught said there is no pending congressional legislation for potential wilderness-designated land on the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests. He remarked the U.S. Forest Service, for the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests, has no plan pending for additional wilderness-designated land on the national forests. Mr. Vaught said the wilderness areas in the national forest have been in place for at least 12 years, and there are no plans to change those areas. He said the wilderness management of those areas is working very well.

Mr. Vaught said there are a number of wilderness study areas that were a part of the BLM wilderness study program before the enhancement act. He said those wilderness study areas are managed under the existing legislation and regulations. Mr. Vaught said the BLM and the national forest service are seeking resolutions to problems in these areas and will be discussing them thoroughly during the public land summit.

Mr. Vaught said the recently released “Roadless Conservation Area Rule,” formerly known as the “Roadless Initiative,” is currently in place. He indicated that about half of the Humboldt-Toiyabe National Forests, about 3 million acres, are part of that rule.

Mr. Vaught said originally there was a great deal of controversy about the rule. He acknowledged there was a misconception regarding this rule. Mr. Vaught said the misconception was the belief that the rule would cause the closure of many existing roads. He said contrary to that belief the rule does not close existing roads; it allows access to previously established roads within the roadless areas. Mr. Vaught explained the main effect the rule has is that it does not allow construction of new roads within the designated roadless areas.

Mr. Vaught said Nevada is a mountainous area and roads have been either constructed or created in almost all areas where roads can exist. He stressed that these established roads would not be closed to the public, and any decisions made concerning these roads would include local citizen and local government contribution to the planning.

Mr. Vaught said there has been a 60-days’ suspension of the implementation of the rule to allow the new administration to study it. At this point it is unknown whether there will be changes made to the rule or not. Mr. Vaught commented that the rule is not expected to change Nevadans’ access to these areas or to change the way these areas are managed.

Senator Rhoads inquired what is the forest service’s definition of a road. Mr. Vaught replied that the definition is not an important part of the rule. He said it was at one point, but that was changed. Mr. Vaught said there are basically two kinds of roads: there are those that are on the list to be maintained every year and there are all the other roads in use on the forest lands. Mr. Vaught said in both cases those roads can be preserved and can be managed appropriately. He stated access is not restricted to those roads and there are no plans to restrict access to those roads.

Senator Rhoads asked whether there was a definition in the regulation that defines a road. Mr. Vaught indicated he did not have it in front of him. Senator Rhoads said that Mr. Vaught could bring the committee the requested information later.

Senator McGinness asked whether the definition worked for all government agencies or whether BLM had a different definition. Mr. Vaught said this rule only applies to the national forest.

Mr. Vaught said in closing that he wanted the committee to know that the forestry service is working hard to make Nevadans proud of the fact that they have national forests in their state.

Senator Jacobsen commented that with the kinds of fires that Nevada has had in the past few years, all of the involved parties need to be on a friendly working relationship to help save the state’s precious resources. Mr. Vaught replied that he agreed with the Senator, and he felt that one of the reasons for the loss of the friendly cooperation was some of the national controversy about the forestry service policies. He commented that the need for “camaraderie,” especially in the fire service areas, is extremely important. Mr. Vaught commented that the forestry service is hoping the additional fire service funding would allow the agencies to work more cooperatively than in the last few years.

Mr. Vaught said he would like the committee to clearly understand that except for the Jarbidge road situation, the forestry service has not closed a single road in Elko County in the last 10 years. He said there has not ever been an effort to try to close access to national forests or public land.

Senator Jacobsen asked whether Mr. Vaught could furnish a list of equipment that is designated for Nevada, such as so many airplanes, so many tankers, and so on. Ms. Shimamoto replied that the forestry service would gladly supply that information. She said, under the 100 percent funding the forestry service receives under the national fire plan, the forestry service has 21 engines, 22 fire prevention units, and 2 helicopters, with a potential third helicopter in the near future. She said those are the regular forest service forces, which are being upgraded.

Ms. Shimamoto said there is great deal of fire-fighting equipment and aircraft that come through the forest service, which are loaned or given to the State of Nevada and then passed on to the local fire departments through the Nevada Division of Forestry (NDF). She said under the national fire plan, the forestry service is hopeful it can provide additional grants for local volunteer fire departments to help them with training, personal equipment, and other fire fighting equipment as well. Ms. Shimamoto said the forestry service would be happy to give the committee a list of the equipment presently under the national fire plan.

Senator Jacobsen said he would like a map of the Jarbidge area for the committee to review so that they would be familiar with the area. Senator Jacobsen said that more interaction between the forestry service and the local fire departments in the form of speakers during the winter months could help improve relations between the state fire fighting personnel and the federal fire fighting personnel. Mr. Vaught replied that the forestry service would be glad to make presentations any time and place the fire departments would like to have them.

Mr. Vaught commented that there are currently 87 submitted grant requests in the state of Nevada that are associated with the fire money. He said the grant requests are currently being processed. Mr. Vaught said these grants would also be available to local communities for additional fire fighting support.

Senator Rhoads adjourned the meeting at 2:55 p.m.

RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED:

Johnnie L. Willis,

Committee Secretary

APPROVED BY:

Senator Dean A. Rhoads, Chairman

DATE: